Saturday, March 20, 2010


Let's hope we get the change (of votes) we need!


Anonymous said...

Lets pray that we can hold them off of being bribed from our Dear leader.

Joe said...

Sandys Thoughts: Thank you for the visit. Prayer is what we have. Pray is what we must do.

selahV said...

This is the most insane group of legislators ever to congregate in Washington, D.C. May God have mercy on them and us all.

Xavier Onassis said...

"Prayer" cracks me up!

Please, go ahead and pray all you want. Pray, pray, pray!

Don't contribute money to conservative political action groups, write letters or make phone calls to your political representatives.

Just pray.

Carry on a one way internal conversation with an imaginary supernatural being who returns the same results as a Magic 8 Ball.

Because that always works.

Ration, reason and logic always has and always will trump "prayer".

Joe said...

selahV: You got that right.

XO: "Ration, reason and logic always has and always will trump 'prayer'."

Never has...never will.

Since I entered into a relationship with God through faith in the finished work of Christ at the cross of Calvary, God has answered every prayer I have ever prayed to Him. Every one.

But prayer is not the magic incantation that gets God to do what I want Him to do. Prayer let's me find out what God is up to and allows me to get on board with Him.

Sometimes He says "Yes," sometimes He says, "No," and sometimes He says, "Wait," but he always answers according to His sovereign will.

He will answer our prayers regarding DC, too. I don't know His answer, yet, but I know He will answer.

I'll tell you tomorrow what His answer was.

Xavier Onassis said...

The lengths of logic that people will jump over to give "god" a pass never ceases to amaze and amuse me.

Joe said...

XO: I am not schooled in quantum physics, that branch of science that deals with discrete, indivisible units of energy called quanta as described by the Quantum Theory.

In fact, I know no more about it than its name.

Those who know quantum physics practice it daily as part of their research and/or job. If I wanted to know about it, I would take courses from those skilled in it and let them teach me what they know.

That I don’t know about it does not mean that it does not exist, but it does mean that I have no basis to form an opinion about its veracity.

Similarly, if one is not schooled in matters of faith, it is not reasonable to expect him/her to understand it.

What I have noticed, though, is that people are quite willing to express an opinion about faith, even though they neither understand it nor practice it.

Although you do not practice it, you are quite willing to ridicule me for doing so, much as the Curies were ridiculed, as was Edward Jenner.

If you ever want to expand your horizons into an area about which you know little, let me know, for I have been living it and teaching it for somewhat over 50 years.

Xavier Onassis said...

First, even though you didn't call me out for it, I'll go ahead and toss you an apology for the mocking tone of my last two comments.

You may be completely wrong about, well, everything, but I don't doubt your sincerity.

I know it is a waste of my time to try and elaborate on my underlying point and a waste of yours to read it, but what the heck.

You are incorrect in your assumption that I know little or nothing about faith.

I was raised by good, God-fearing Christian parents. We went to church every Sunday. Starting in the Evangelical United Brethren church before they were assimilated by the Methodists.

I went to catechism classes and was baptised and became a member of the church. My mother sang in the church choir.

I've studied the Bible, cover to cover, many times.

I've also studied Judaism, Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, Sufism and just about any other "ism" you can imagine.

But unlike you, I reached the conclusion that they were all false because they all required faith.

By definition, faith is belief without evidence.

I can't do that.

Although I understand that faith sustains many people and some of the great minds in history have been people of faith, I just can't do it. I've tried.

My problem with faith is that if you are able to believe one thing without evidence, like the existence of a God, then you are able to believe other things without evidence.

I view that as intellectual laziness.

A person with faith suffers no burden to think things through, subject what they are told or taught to objective analysis or engage in due diligance.

Like the idea that if you martyr yourself by killing infidels you get a fast track to heaven and 72 virgins.

Or the idea that your King or Emperor or Pope or President has a Divine Imprimatur and must be obeyed.

How many people have died because of faith?

If people had taken a step back and said "Wait a minute. I'm gonna need you to prove that to me.", how many lives could have been saved?

If you combine 1 atom of oxygen with 2 atoms of hydrogen, you get water.

It happens everytime. Nothing else ever happens. It doesn't require faith. It's a fact.

If you applied your prayer rules to molecular chemistry, combining 1 atom of oxygen with 2 atoms of hydrogen might result in water, or it might not.

It might result in iron, or gold, or silicon, or nothing at all depending on the unknowable Will Of God and how much faith the person had in said God.

To my way of thinking, that's a pretty capricious and ineffecient way to run a universe.

OK, I'm done.

I've not been disrespectful, I've not been profane or blasphemous and I have not attacked or insulted anyone. I've merely expressed my point of view.

Joe said...

XO: Trust me (or not), I know where you're coming from.

I don't argue faith with people, I just present it and let them decide.

You are certainly free to decide. You are not free to choose the consequences of what you decide.

Learning about faith is not the same as exercising faith.

You board an airplane, you have faith that the pilot has been well trained, is concerned about the passengers' safe arrival at their destinations and is focused on the job in front of him/her.

Occasionally, pilots do not fulfill their office, usually to no great harm, but occasionally with disasterous results.

Yet we still get on airplanes without a shred of evidence that the pilots are well trained...just trusting that they are (and that they have complied with the applicable government regulations relative to pilot training).

I, for one, have never examined a pilot's certificate on a commercial flight, yet I have faith that he/she will get me safely where I want to go.

The question is not, "Do you have faith?" You do. The question is "where do you place that faith."

That you get to choose.

It is the most important choice you will ever make.

Xavier Onassis said...

In your example, we at least have the option, should we choose to exercise it, to remove faith from the question, examine the pilot's credentials and make an informed decision based on the evidence.

If I were able to scrutinize an equally objective, unbiased and empirical analysis of God's claim to existence, divinity, omniscience and moral sertitude, I might be persuaded to take a kinder attitude.

And please, don't direct me to the Bible. Don't even get me started on that mistranslated piece of political patchwork.

Joe said...